TTRPGs & D&D

[altcunningham]

I might have agreed with you but then I just saw the Hegseth AI thing so I don't know what the f*** to think anymore.

Jungle Dark Sun?!

 

[Damien]

I might have agreed with you but then I just saw the Hegseth AI thing so I don't know what the f*** to think anymore.

I don't mean to give too much credit to the folks in charge at WOTC or Hasbro, but I would say there's still a pretty significant difference between companies like them that are hedging around the idea of using AI to save money (and are therefore very cognizant of when maybe it won't do that) and our truly insane-levels of corrupt government officials that own stock in AI and will literally destroy the human race to make six more dollars on their portfolio.

Jungle Dark Sun?!

RIGHT?!

 

[docsilence]

Eh, once or twice a year the CEO of Hasbro has to go suck investor dicks for a few hours and had to tell them they're "looking into AI" because the investor class are brain-damaged and if you have investors you have to tell them you think AI is the future of blowjobs or they won't give you more investor money. WOTC pulped and reissued 2-3 books last year when they found out an artist they'd worked with for years had turned in work he created with AI because the customer backlash was so aggressive.

It's the corporate tap dance, if you're not saying you're investing in AI right now you're fucked, but they haven't really made a move in that direction and have demonstrably pulled back when they've used it by accident, when everyone was getting bamboozled. I swear Shawn and Teos over on Mastering Dungeons have talked about Chris Cocks discussing AI during the company's investor call four times since I started listening to their show and it's just rinse and repeat. I swear 90% of the AI problem is rich investors are absolute fucking morons who only understand buzzwords.

 

[altcunningham]

When I bowed out of that campaign I just wrote a respectful short, "I'm going to step out, I don't find myself to be a good fit at this table."

On one hand I felt like if I broke down the reasons why, that was almost disrespectful to myself because they were there. They should be able to piece it. And I just didn't want to say anything bad. The campaign works for them. It didn't for me. I'll survive.

But now I have had the DM and his bestie in my inbox practically demanding that I give them an exit interview and explain everything that I feel went wrong for the campaign. Which I don't owe anyone. But the chaotic part of me thinks it would be fun to write an objective list of grievances since they did ask for it.

And then the sad part is now that it's clear I'm out, the other chill players also want me to detail what went wrong, and again, I just don't want to spill that tea as the kids say.

As a DM, would you want me to just tell you my bullet points?

 

[JakeEkiss]

Kids on Bikes is a lot of fun. I prefer Tales from the Loop if you're gonna be playing "kids in weird peril" but it's a great game.

Tales from the Loop is on my "to play" list, along with many other things. I love that dude's art so much and I absolutely would like to run or play a game in that setting.

Weirdly I just don't hear anyone PLAYING Draw Steel but it might just be that Daggerheart and Shadowdark players are that much louder online.

I'm setting up a work group right now to play the intro adventure (Delian Tomb). So far I'm really interested in a lot of the mechanical ideas, and if they play half as well at the table as they look I think I'll really get into it. I'll of course let folks here know how it goes.

I see there's some panic about Hasbro and AI and D&D is dead.

Thanks for the good news

I kid. I kid. I am deeply exhausted by the weekly panic over whatever WotC is doing. I just cannot dredge anymore care from Lake Give-A-Fuck. I've got the 5e books. I've still got a Master D&D Beyond account for at least another year. That's where my interest in their drama stops. I'm probably not buying any more official books after all the OGL stuff and we'll see how long it is before I let my DDB account lapse to a free one. They burned me out right when there were a bunch of other games popping up I was ready to play. I got 6 straight years of play out of 5e and that's pretty good. I don't regret it, but I'm also not chained to it. I started on stuff outside D&D, I have no sentimental loyalty to it specifically.

I LOVE how much thought they've put into making this a 'familiar fantasy' game, but also making a lot of things we're used to very UNfamiliar so we can explore and enjoy the world-building in a way you don't generally get from traditional fantasy settings anymore. When he describes what I guess is their version of the Feywild as "Jungle Dark Sun" I'm like... oh yeah, I wanna go there. And their unique spin on Dwarves, Gnomes, etc has been really fun to listen to him talk about.

Very much this. From appearances it'll be very easy to re-skin into my setting, but the more and more I find of theirs the more interested I am in trying it. Dragonfly people?! Oh, and apparently they're prototyping a Demon ancestry for the future (if you know the difference between Devils and Demons in DS this seems wild)!? What what???

There's also just a lot of mechanical stuff that I already know I'm going to vibe with. Kits instead of granular weapons and armor is huge for me. Yes. Thank you. While I don't loathe inventory management in games, it usually does feel like the gristle I've got to chew through to get to the meat.

I swear 90% of the AI problem is rich investors are absolute fucking morons who only understand buzzwords.

And the other 10% is credulous boobs everywhere else who can't see it for the shell game it is.

But now I have had the DM and his bestie in my inbox practically demanding that I give them an exit interview and explain everything that I feel went wrong for the campaign. Which I don't owe anyone. But the chaotic part of me thinks it would be fun to write an objective list of grievances since they did ask for it.

Nah, you don't owe anybody an explanation for walking. If they are sincerely baffled, they probably weren't paying much attention to you in the first place.

As a DM, would you want me to just tell you my bullet points?

Riffing on this after the above, I've never had someone actively leave one of my games, but I have had problems to sort out in groups as the DM, and there was never a time that's happened where I didn't have a pretty clear idea what the problem was. Whether I agreed it was worth causing drama over is a different question, but I always knew the grievance without it being spelled out.

Them asking for explanation, for the not chill folks, seems like just an excuse to argue their case to you. Deny them that because it will only be a headache for you. The Chill players are a different story, that one I might consider, but only if you actually trust that talking to them in confidence will be respected. Last thing you want is word getting around second hand.

All that said "hey, it just isn't for me right now" is a complete answer with no need for extension.

 

[docsilence]

As a DM, would you want me to just tell you my bullet points?

Unless I did something actively hurtful or offensive, I don't actually need to know. (If I did, tell me, cos I don't want to be a piece of shit human being.) Most of the folks who have dropped out of my games have been pure scheduling conflict, but I had one fella drop off because he was a deeply intense min-maxer and our campaign was shenanigans, and he just wanted to let us know it was a bad fit but we were all still cool.

Weirdly the two players who quit that bother me to this day were two of my closest friends, we did the Ravenfolly Institute Presents actual play for two years together AND a four year home game. They crashed out on podcasting and then poof, ghosted every single person in oru gaming group without a word. To this day I want to be like If I did something asshole-ish I would like to know so I don't do it to anyone else, but by the same token, if you're gonna ghost someone you've talked to every day for 15 years, be a fucking adult about it maybe.

Tales from the Loop is on my "to play" list, along with many other things. I love that dude's art so much and I absolutely would like to run or play a game in that setting.

One of my dream GM scenarios is running a campaign with Tales from the Loop and Things from the Flood - players playing the same character, but in alternating sessions where you're a kid (Tales) vs. a teen ((Things). Things from the Flood is deadlier with the possibility of character death. I want do "you shared this bizarre experience as children, how did it impact who you became later" (and if someone doesn't want to play the same kid... what happened to you in the interim?)

(I own all of Stalenhag's art books. Easily one of my favorite working artists. Also SUPER anti-AI.)

I kid. I kid. I am deeply exhausted by the weekly panic over whatever WotC is doing. I just cannot dredge anymore care from Lake Give-A-Fuck.

This is where I'm at with WOTC. They make dumb decisions but their dumb decisions don't annoy me nearly as much as the cottage industry of Youtubers who make most of their annual income complaining about WOTC (all of whom will then accept invites to WOTC events). We get it, guys, you hate the company. I hate Elon Musk but I don't make a video about it every week, I just quit Twitter...

And the other 10% is credulous boobs everywhere else who can't see it for the shell game it is.

Yep. Every. Goddamned. Day. And between the investor dumbasses and the end user boobs they're going to crash the economy so hard.

 

[docsilence]

On a more analog note, painted up some xenos and crew for an Alien game at some point.

 

[TheSameIdiot]

Reminds me that I really oughta run Mothership soon.

As a DM, would you want me to just tell you my bullet points?

I would, however...

I see this going one of four different ways:

1) You leave without saying anything; the table scapegoats you for one reason or another
2) You list your grievances; the table twists your words to excuse any bad behavior/poor gameplay
3) You list your grievances; they beg you to come back
4) You list your grievances; the table takes it as constructive criticism and attempts to improve

Of those, the fourth option is by far the least likely. Human beings, almost universally, cannot take criticism.

 

[altcunningham]

Reminds me that I really oughta run Mothership soon.

I would, however...

I see this going one of four different ways:

1) You leave without saying anything; the table scapegoats you for one reason or another
2) You list your grievances; the table twists your words to excuse any bad behavior/poor gameplay
3) You list your grievances; they beg you to come back
4) You list your grievances; the table takes it as constructive criticism and attempts to improve

Of those, the fourth option is by far the least likely. Human beings, almost universally, cannot take criticism.

Agree, and I bet it'd be 2 and 3. I feel good about my exit, I've just never had anyone want a rundown after the fact.

Truly, it is my past groups and our group that really helped me come to the decision in the first place because none of this ever comes up with those groups. And I feel like we accomplish way more in our 3 hours than I ever have with the other and that's my personal preference.

 

[JakeEkiss]

One of my dream GM scenarios is running a campaign with Tales from the Loop and Things from the Flood - players playing the same character, but in alternating sessions where you're a kid (Tales) vs. a teen ((Things).

100% would play.

(I own all of Stalenhag's art books. Easily one of my favorite working artists. Also SUPER anti-AI.)

That's what happens when early AI bros message you online and tell you they're feeding your art into the machine to specifically make you obsolete (a thing I saw happen on his social media and I cannot imagine how livid it would make me).

 

[Damien]

As a DM, would you want me to just tell you my bullet points?

As a DM, I probably would never ask for something like this. I'd probably just prompt you instead and be like 'scheduling conflict, not vibing, or did I make you uncomfortable/angry?' If the answer was 'not vibing' - I'd leave the door open to talk about it if you want to. But I'd never ask for more info because I probably don't need more info. I'm running a game, we're all playing it, and you decided it's not the game for you. That happens.
Plus, as was said, I don't know a lot of DMs that can run a game and NOT be aware of an issue at the table. Either these people (respectfully?) are dumb as shit, or intentionally ignorant. Either way, my exact answer would be 'if you don't know what the problems at the table are, then I'm glad I won't be there anymore.'

There's also just a lot of mechanical stuff that I already know I'm going to vibe with. Kits instead of granular weapons and armor is huge for me. Yes. Thank you. While I don't loathe inventory management in games, it usually does feel like the gristle I've got to chew through to get to the meat.

At first I was nervous about this because I am a guy that really likes to be detailed about my weapons and armor, and I like upgrading and changing those things to mean something. BUT, the more I looked at it the more it felt like this system wasn't going to hamper that. It'll just change how it expresses in the game, and that's fine. Maybe even preferable since you're not default locked-in to "well, I'm low level so I can't be wearing plate armor" - which I've always hated.

 

[altcunningham]

No, I demand a Diablo Exile Resident Evil storage case game.

 

[JakeEkiss]

At first I was nervous about this because I am a guy that really likes to be detailed about my weapons and armor, and I like upgrading and changing those things to mean something. BUT, the more I looked at it the more it felt like this system wasn't going to hamper that. It'll just change how it expresses in the game, and that's fine. Maybe even preferable since you're not default locked-in to "well, I'm low level so I can't be wearing plate armor" - which I've always hated.

Absolutely. At least for me, one of my least favorite conversations to happen at any ttrpg session is when folks start arguing over whether the mechanical bonuses of a "longsword" are "realistic" vs the bonuses of a "broadsword" or whatever. I also like that you can swap kits regularly which allows for a lot of personalization, especially when some kits have overlapping equipment (sniper/arcane archer, pugilist/martial artist, swasbuckler/battlemind, etc.). Feels very much like picking a kit based on the sort of action scene you want to have today, and that's awesome.

 

[JakeEkiss]

No, I demand a Diablo Exile Resident Evil storage case game.

I'm not going to pretend I don't love a perfectly full case in Resident Evil... but I love capping some zombies way more.

 

[TheSameIdiot]

Truly, it is my past groups and our group that really helped me come to the decision in the first place because none of this ever comes up with those groups. And I feel like we accomplish way more in our 3 hours than I ever have with the other and that's my personal preference.

My other table is heading in this direction. We had a 4.5-hour session last week, and we didn't accomplish anything. We took up an adventure hook and decided to complete another side quest while we were in the area. Turns out the quest area is far as fuck from our home base. Between shopping, random encounters, and getting lost in the woods, we didn't even start either quest. I think we're close to the starting area. Not sure OSR/traditional hex crawls are for me.

More than four hours without plot progress makes me want to pay less attention. I dissociate, though I know that isn't helping, either.

I'm next on our group's DM list. I have a feeling it's going to be a while.

One of my dream GM scenarios is running a campaign with Tales from the Loop and Things from the Flood - players playing the same character, but in alternating sessions where you're a kid (Tales) vs. a teen ((Things). Things from the Flood is deadlier with the possibility of character death. I want do "you shared this bizarre experience as children, how did it impact who you became later" (and if someone doesn't want to play the same kid... what happened to you in the interim?)

Somehow missed this until Jake quoted it. While many of my upcoming games are traditional fantasy campaigns, I yearn to do more experimental stuff like this. That sounds awesome.